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POLL: Is Alvaro Uribe A Puppet Of The US Empire?

Latin America Revolts Against The US Empire: Except Colombia's Puppet

The Latin American Revolt by John Bellamy Foster

The revolt against U.S. hegemony in Latin America in the opening years of the twenty-first century constitutes nothing less than a new historical moment. Latin America, to quote Noam Chomsky, is “reasserting its independence” in an attempt to free itself from centuries of imperialist domination. The gravity of this threat to U.S. power is increasingly drawing the attention of Washington. Julia Sweig, Latin American program director at the Council on Foreign Relations, argues that the twenty-first century is likely to be known as the “Anti-American Century,” marking a growing intolerance of the “waning” U.S. empire. Outweighing even the resistance to the U.S. war machine in Iraq in this respect, Sweig suggests, is the political realignment to the left in Latin America, which, in destabilizing U.S. rule in the Americas, offers a “prophetic microcosm” of what can be expected worldwide.1

The United States, through the 1823 Monroe Doctrine and the 1904 Roosevelt Corollary, Sweig asserts, long ago established its “right to preemptive military intervention in the Americas.” But Latin Americans themselves rarely saw it that way. “What was for the United States the rightful and manifest extension of power in the name of national interest, values, markets, democracy, or nation building became for Mexicans, Cubans, Nicaraguans, Haitians, Hondurans, Costa Ricans, Dominicans...trespasses of sovereignty by a colossus.” Since the Second World War, Latin Americans have been subjected again and again to U.S. interventions (replicating a long history of U.S. intrusions in the region): “Guatemala in 1954; Cuba in 1961; Dominican Republic in 1965; Chile from 1970 to 1989; the Southern Cone dictatorships in the 1970s and 1980s; the contras, counterinsurgency, and death squads in Central America; invasions in Grenada and Panama.” U.S. Secretary of State Henry Kissinger flatly declared, with respect to Allende’s Chile, that it was within the rights of the United States to “set the limits of diversity” in Latin America.2

The most recent U.S. attempt to “set the limits of diversity” in Latin America by military means (apart from the continuing U.S. covert war in Colombia) was the coup d’état carried out against democratically elected President Hugo Chávez in Venezuela in 2002. Not only did the United States know about, help plan, provide logistical support for, and covertly give a green light to the coup, but it greeted it, once it had occurred, with open arms—offering immediate diplomatic recognition to the coup plotters. Nevertheless, the coup quickly fell apart, due to an immense popular upsurge in support of Chávez, and Washington’s plans backfired, leading, as Sweig notes, to Chávez’s rise “as a symbol of defiance of the United States, just as Fidel Castro was in the twentieth century.”3

But if Chávez and the Bolivarian Revolution that he has helped inspire are today the primary symbols of the new Latin American revolt, the upsurge of Latin America’s peoples is now to be seen everywhere in the southern part of the hemisphere. A brief list would have to include: the election of Evo Morales of the Movement Toward Socialism as president of Bolivia in 2005; the alliance of Venezuela, Cuba, and Bolivia in the Bolivarian Alternative for Latin America and the Caribbean (ALBA); the 2006 election of Rafael Correa, a proponent, together with Chávez, Morales, and Castro, of “socialism for the twenty-first century,” as president of Ecuador; the election of Sandinista leader Daniel Ortega as president of Nicaragua in 2006; the dramatic electoral and social movement struggles in Mexico (where the populace in the millions rose up to protest the stolen 2006 election, and where momentous popular struggles are occurring in the regions of Oaxaca and Chiapas); the unrelenting peaceful insurgency of the Landless Workers’ Movement in Brazil; Argentina’s repudiation of external debt in defiance of the World Bank along with its widespread factory takeovers; the rejection of the U.S.-sponsored Free Trade Area of the Americas and the expansion of the Southern Cone’s Common Market (MERCOSUR)—with Venezuela now a member; the continuing resistance of the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Columbia (FARC) in the face of the U.S. “Plan Colombia” Cuba’s successful handling of its “Special Period” and its transition to a post-Fidel government. Altogether these developments point to the strength, breadth, pervasiveness, and multi-faceted nature of the new Latin American revolt.

The fact that the United States has historically exercised in Latin America all “the supremacy of power which hegemony provides” has meant that the U.S. ruling class and its attendant foreign policy elites have frequently viewed the entire region as a “laboratory” of U.S. global rule.4 It was in the U.S.-sponsored dictatorships of the Southern Cone of South America (Brazil, Chile, Argentina, and Uruguay) that neoliberalism, i.e., the promotion of a new naked capitalism in response to world economic slowdown—requiring the elimination of all state protections for the population and all limits on the movement of capital—was first imposed. This process began even before the onset of the third world debt crisis in the early 1980s, and was identified above all with the alliance between the Pinochet dictatorship and the Chicago school of economics led by Milton Friedman. But according to Francisco Dominiguez, head of Latin American Studies at Middlesex University in the United Kingdom, “it was ‘Third Way’ administrations such as Concertación in Chile, the Peronist Menem in Argentina, the traditional parties, Blanco and Colorado in Uruguay, the MIR-Banzer alliance in Bolivia, ADECO and COPEI in Venezuela, Fernando Henrique Cardoso’s Partido Social Democratico Brasileiro, in Brazil, and the most pro-U.S. factions within the Mexican PRI, just to cite the most prominent examples, which systematized, perfected and consolidated neoliberalism in these countries.”5

The result was an unmitigated economic disaster, represented by the “lost decade” of economic growth of the 1980s. In 1980, 41 percent of the Latin American population was living in poverty. By 1990 this had jumped to 48 percent, while in 2002 it was still at 44 percent. Nearly half of Latin America’s poor, around 97 million people, are presently struggling to live on an income of less than a dollar a day. Meanwhile the number of Latin American billionaires has more than quadrupled since the late 1980s.6

Today’s Latin American independence movement is thus an attempt to overturn neoliberalism forced on Latin America by the United States and the other advanced capitalist states (enforced by the IMF and the World Bank). As Morales stated, “The cause of all these acts of bloodshed [against the exploited population], and for the uprising of the Bolivian people, has a name: neoliberalism.”7 The nature of this struggle necessitated a radical revolt against U.S. imperialism and capitalism, and against the internal relations of exploitation that have arisen in this context. Leadership in the revolt was therefore assumed mainly by anti-capitalist, anti-imperialist, indigenous, and socialist forces. Class and other social struggles continue in all of these countries, and there are considerable tensions between nations. Nevertheless, there are also rising signs of a new Latin American solidarity.

The foremost example of this is ALBA. Beginning primarily as an alliance between Cuba and Venezuela, it now includes Bolivia, and has the support of Ecuador’s Correa. ALBA has centered on the development of cooperative barter arrangements between Latin American states in order to free the region from the iron grip of global monopoly-finance capital centered in the North. The best known example has been the exchange of Venezuelan oil for twenty thousand Cuban doctors to help bring basic health care to at least seventeen million Venezuelans. But wider cooperative arrangements are now being pushed under the auspices of ALBA in areas as diverse as petrochemicals, literacy, media (ALBA’s Telusur project), and even a proposed Bank of the South and Latin American currency.8

The growing turn to the left in Latin America has of course not gone unnoticed in the Colossus of the North, which has attempted on a number of occasions since the 2002 coup to engineer regime change in Venezuela (including backing an unsuccessful bosses’ oil lockout and supporting opposition forces in a presidential recall referendum, which nonetheless led to a resounding victory for Chávez). In February 2006 U.S. Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld provocatively compared the reelection of Chávez in Venezuela to the election of Hitler as German Chancellor.9 In June 2007 Secretary of State Rice accused Venezuela of backing away from democracy by refusing to renew the broadcasting license of Radio Caracas TV, a private broadcaster that had actively supported the 2002 military coup in Venezuela.

For Washington, the key problem is how to depose Chávez, end chavismo, and bring the Bolivarian Revolution to a halt—as the most crucial step in the resubjugation of Latin America. Its primary “diplomatic” strategy is to undermine support for Chávez both internally within Venezuela and externally in relation to other major Latin American states. Richard Haass, president of the Council on Foreign Relations and former director of policy planning in Bush’s state department, emphasized in November 2006 that the object was to formulate a long-term strategy “to dilute Chávez’s appeal and power.” The main tool to achieve this was for the United States, in agreement with other Latin American states, to establish “red lines in foreign and domestic policies” such that, if Chávez crossed them, they would automatically trigger the isolation of the Bolivarian Republic.

Haass’s remarks were presented in the foreword to a report of the Council of Foreign Relations’ “Center for Political Action” entitled, Living With Hugo, authored by Richard Lapper, Latin American correspondent for the London Financial Times. According to this report, a primary threat associated with the Bolivarian Revolution is its “anti-capitalist crusade.” The chief tactical means for upsetting the Venezuelan state, opening it up to more forcible action from abroad, the report detailed, was to establish in advance “specific red lines,” determined by the United States and “regional leaders, such as Brazil, Chile, Argentina, and Mexico.” This would entail agreements “on how to respond in the event that such red lines are crossed.” A joint “preventive-action” response could be constructed in advance to counter any steps Chávez might take that would “cause a crisis in Venezuela or the region.” Red lines could be drawn, it was specified, around (1) any attempt to amend the Venezuelan constitution to extend Chávez’s term of office; (2) Venezuelan support for destabilizing forces in other countries; or (3) a military relationship with Iran or some other enemy of the United States. Any contraventions of what the United States considers to be “democracy” could be red-lined, provided that the other major Latin American powers agreed.10

In the campaign around the expired broadcasting license of Radio Caracas TV we can see the Council on Foreign Relations plan already being put into action. Human Rights Watch has led the charge calling this a “serious setback for freedom of expression” (for super-rich media moguls!).11 At the same time its Executive Director, Kenneth Roth, is sitting on the Council on Foreign Relations’ Center for Preventive Action Advisory Committee (headed by Reagan’s former chairman of the joint chiefs of staff General John W. Vessey) that has been planning the Bolivarian Republic’s downfall. And all along the vast monetary resources and murderous skills of the CIA operate in the background. There are no crimes the U.S. ruling class will not commit to counter the “anti-capitalist crusade”—i.e. the liberation struggle of the peoples of Latin America, the original base of the U.S. empire.

The most important guarantee for the future of Latin America under these circumstances is the growing solidarity of its peoples—and the growing solidarity of all the world’s peoples with Latin America—in order to prevent further U.S. interventions. Evoking the spirit of nineteenth-century Latin American revolution, Chávez declared before the United Nations:

We fight for Venezuela, for Latin American integration and the world. We reaffirm our infinite faith in humankind. We are thirsty for peace and justice in order to survive as a species. Simón Bolívar, the founding father of our country and guide to our revolution swore to never allow his hands to be idle or his soul to rest until he had broken the shackles which bound us to the empire. Now is the time to not allow our hands to be idle or our souls to rest until we save humanity.12

But while the hands of those who resist the shackles of empire must never be idle, those in the United States and throughout the world who believe in Latin America’s struggle for free human development must insist that the hands of the empire itself be restrained. Hands off Latin America!

http://monthlyreview.org/0707foster.php

By Byron_Kostner on Nov 4, 2009, 15:32 in Politics & the war.

Byron_Kostner says on Nov 4, 2009, 15:32:

Answer: YES

Actions speak louder than words, but the self-righteous crusaders want to live by their own rules.

3 funny, 1 helpful.

viajero123 (☼Travelguide writer) says on Nov 4, 2009, 15:41:

Did you write this, or are you presenting someone else's work as yours?

0 funny, 3 helpful.

capt_j says on Nov 4, 2009, 15:45:

Byron,

Seriously, you really believe this s***?

0 funny, 3 helpful.

jimbo67856 says on Nov 4, 2009, 15:47:

http://monthlyreview.org/0707foster.php

That's where this came from. Plaja ... plajer ... plagia ... how's that go?

Errors of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it. ---- Thomas Jefferson

0 funny, 1 helpful.

Woodde says on Nov 4, 2009, 16:04:

So, what you're saying is that the rest of Latin America wants their economies to be just like Venezuela and that they think the Colombian economy is a failure and needs to come into line also? Am I interpreting that correctly?

4/9/09

0 funny, 1 helpful.

Byron_Kostner says on Nov 4, 2009, 16:09:

US Empire's interest at work in Equador, greed over humanity.

Actions speak louder than words, but the self-righteous crusaders want to live by their own rules.

3 funny, 0 helpful.

Byron_Kostner says on Nov 4, 2009, 16:15:

The World's Bank economic hitmen at work in Bolivia, results in privatazion of water, but it didn't work out too well.

http://www.pbs.org/frontlineworld/stories/bolivia/leasing.html

Actions speak louder than words, but the self-righteous crusaders want to live by their own rules.

2 funny, 0 helpful.

Byron_Kostner says on Nov 4, 2009, 16:31:

The Italians ain't going to take it... hopefully other countries follow suit.

CIA agents sentenced in Italy rendition case

First legal blow to Bush policy of seizing suspects from Europe's streets

By David Usborne

In a stiff rebuke from across the Atlantic to the policies of former US president George Bush, a judge in Milan yesterday sentenced 23 American citizens to up to eight years in prison for their part in the secret abduction of a Muslim cleric in 2003 and his rendition for questioning in Egypt, where he was imprisoned and tortured.

All but one of the 23 US citizens were identified by prosecutors in the three-year trial as members or former members of the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA). It was the first such trial of US citizens in a foreign nation related to the now widely discredited secret rendition activities by the CIA, part of Mr Bush's so-called "War on Terror".

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/cia-agents-sentenced-...

Actions speak louder than words, but the self-righteous crusaders want to live by their own rules.

3 funny, 0 helpful.

wolfttz says on Nov 4, 2009, 17:29:

Remember, when push comes to shove the USA still has the big bombs.

wolffen

0 funny, 3 helpful.

billyb says on Nov 4, 2009, 18:13:

"Did you write this, or are you presenting someone else's work as yours?"

Just the usual copy and paste from Byron, you know he's incapable of coming up with anything himself.

"All I want to know is where I'm going to die, so I never go there" Unkown (at least to me) wise man.

0 funny, 3 helpful.

makopp5 (☼Travelguide writer) says on Nov 4, 2009, 18:13:

That`s probaganda from Anncol, the web newspage from farc.

0 funny, 3 helpful.

Byron_Kostner says on Nov 4, 2009, 19:10:

Woodde, "So, what you're saying is that the rest of Latin America wants their economies to be just like Venezuela and that they think the Colombian economy is a failure and needs to come into line also? Am I interpreting that correctly?"

So, what you're saying is that it's okay to whore yourself out for an iPod, new outfit, fast car, big house, acceptance? "F" everyone else, as long as you get what you want, right?

billyb, ""Did you write this, or are you presenting someone else's work as yours?"

Just the usual copy and paste from Byron, you know he's incapable of coming up with anything himself."

And what original thoughts, ideas, solutions have you come up with?

makopp5, "That`s probaganda from Anncol, the web newspage from farc."

What are you talking about? As usual, you are blind to the truth, nonense. Everything looks honkey-dorey from atop your apartment in El Poblado.

Actions speak louder than words, but the self-righteous crusaders want to live by their own rules.

3 funny, 0 helpful.

billyb says on Nov 4, 2009, 19:16:

My solutions? Having foreign pedophiles kicked out of Colombia, for one (and local ones strung up).

"All I want to know is where I'm going to die, so I never go there" Unkown (at least to me) wise man.

0 funny, 2 helpful.

Byron_Kostner says on Nov 4, 2009, 19:42:

YAWN. ZzZzZzZzZzZzZz......... good night.

Actions speak louder than words, but the self-righteous crusaders want to live by their own rules.

1 funny, 1 helpful.

billyb says on Nov 4, 2009, 20:07:

Wassamaatta Byron?

"All I want to know is where I'm going to die, so I never go there" Unkown (at least to me) wise man.

0 funny, 0 helpful.

jimbo67856 says on Nov 4, 2009, 20:31:

billyb says on Nov 4, 2009, 20:07 (today): flag

"Wassamaatta Byron?"

Embarrassment makes him tired.

Errors of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it. ---- Thomas Jefferson

0 funny, 1 helpful.

Woodde says on Nov 4, 2009, 20:45:

Byron_Kostner says on Nov 4, 2009, 19:10 (today): flag
So, what you're saying is that it's okay to whore yourself out for an iPod, new outfit, fast car, big house, acceptance? "F" everyone else, as long as you get what you want, right?
-------------------------------------------
Byron,
Are you intentionally trying to avoid answering my question? Also, how do you define whoring yourself out? I asked a straight forward question and you answered with a non-sense question.

So, just to simplify things: Are you saying that every economy in Latin America should be like Venezuela's economy? It is a simple question, it only requires a yes or a no with a supporting argument. I'll even accept "sort of" if it has a supporting argument.

You see, this is called debate. We don't just spout off whatever comes to mind. We get to the meat and potatoes of the matter and each list our reasoning for our positions. We discuss the positive and negative aspects of each other's viewpoint, then, hopefully, we come to a well reasoned middle ground. There will be points where we completely disagree no matter what, but there is always a common ground.

4/9/09

0 funny, 2 helpful.

billyb says on Nov 4, 2009, 20:48:

Woodde, I hope you weren't expecting more than that from him.

"All I want to know is where I'm going to die, so I never go there" Unkown (at least to me) wise man.

0 funny, 1 helpful.

Woodde says on Nov 4, 2009, 20:57:

billyb says on Nov 4, 2009, 20:48 (today): flag
Woodde, I hope you weren't expecting more than that from him.
----------------------------------------------

I'm not, but by him continually avoiding the questions, he blatantly shows the world his argument's complete lack of merit.

4/9/09

0 funny, 1 helpful.

Juepaje says on Nov 5, 2009, 01:51:

99% of the time I am in total disagreement with Byron. First, he did not write the article and never claimed to have written it. He listed his sorce and gave credit to the author. While I don't agree with all that the author has written, there is a lot of truth in it. Read Confessions of an Economic Hit Man by John Perkins. I am no left winger but am a US Constitutionalist. The US has horrible history in Latin America. Read the true story about the Panama Canal or other stories going back to the Spanish-American War and we don't look so well. No one is suggesting that Venezuela is the ideal state of Latin America or that Chavez is any hero. He paid off Bolivia's external debts and paid off most of Ecuador's and Venezueala practically has no debt. Their economies are in shambles but they were in shambles before Chavez arrived on the scene. I am no Chavista or FARC supporter either but do know how corporations get countries all over the world indebted and that the poorest become poorer and the rich get richer. You can look up the numbers yourself on the IMF or CIA web pages for poverty all over the world and it is usually directly related to debt for un-necessary or overblown projects that were wasted capital. Colombia now has a GDP to debt at 50%. The US and England are at 100% debt to GDP and getting worse. Follow that ratio over time and it does not end well for the debtors because eventually the lender will demand payment and it will have to be with something of value. If the currency is too far debased, then payment is made via natural resources. You can call me whatever names you wish but I am a patriot 1st and despise what the big corporations do and have done over the past 50 years to the 3rd World and the US. Thanks for posting it Byron. It was an interesting read.

Sic enim dilexit Deus mundum ut Filium suum unigenitum daret ut omnis qui credit in eum non pereat sed habeat vitam aeternam.

0 funny, 2 helpful.

El Expatriado says on Nov 5, 2009, 02:21:

If he's a puppet he's a pretty popular one, and definitely doing a way better job than the "Independent" guy next door.

0 funny, 1 helpful.

El Expatriado says on Nov 5, 2009, 02:26:

Escuse me, biut I find a lot of Latin Americans and other people with low self esteem in developing countries are really good at blaming all thier problems on someone else. The "Multi-national corporations" make a good, convenein, popular scapegoat.

People should start taking responsibility for their own situation, and make the best of what is available insted of blaming others on their short comings.

0 funny, 1 helpful.

El Expatriado says on Nov 5, 2009, 02:28:

And excuse my typos.

0 funny, 0 helpful.

Byron_Kostner says on Nov 5, 2009, 03:27:

US responsible for coup d’état in Chile - it's NOT about spreading DEMOCRACY

The Chilean coup d'état of 1973 was a watershed event in the history of Chile and the Soviet-American Cold War. On 11 September 1973, the government of President Salvador Allende was overthrown by the military in a coup d’état.

The coup occurred two months after a first failed attempt, the Tanquetazo — Tank putsch — and a month after the Chamber of Deputies condemned President Allende’s breaches of the Constitution.

The US backed military junta took control of the government, comprised of the heads of the Air Force, Navy, Carabineros (Chilean police force) and the Army lead by General Augusto Pinochet. General Pinochet assumed power and ended Allende's democratically elected Popular Unity government.

During the air raids and ground attacks that preceded the coup, Allende gave his last speech where he vowed to stay in the presidential palace.The official cause of death was suicide. After the coup Pinochet established a military government marked by severe human rights violations that ruled Chile until 1990.

The US government and military were responsible for the death of Americans in Chile after the coup d’état.

Actions speak louder than words, but the self-righteous crusaders want to live by their own rules.

1 funny, 0 helpful.

Byron_Kostner says on Nov 5, 2009, 03:29:

"If he's a puppet he's a pretty popular one, and definitely doing a way better job than the "Independent" guy next door."

A puppet is a puppet, regardless of how the "guy nex door" runs his country.

Actions speak louder than words, but the self-righteous crusaders want to live by their own rules.

1 funny, 0 helpful.

oneforyourmillion says on Nov 5, 2009, 04:11:

POLL: Is Alvaro Uribe A Puppet Of The US Empire?"

Where I come from the puppet master gets paid and the puppet gets to dance.

All I see is Colombia receiving a lt of money and the US dancing.

0 funny, 0 helpful.

Juepaje says on Nov 5, 2009, 04:24:

El Expatriado,

Please explain to me how the average Colombian is responsible for the national external debt of Colombia to the IMF. How is the average Jose in Honduras responsible for that country's external national debt to the IMF? Yes it is easy to blame multinational companies because they are the ones that profit from these debts. Again I beg you to read Confessions of an Economic Hit Man and it will become more obvious to you. I used to right along with you until I really began studying our history with Latin Americain in real history books and biographies. I do not believe Uribe is a puppet but he is damn sure indebted to the US for his Plan Colombia and the US tax payer for the Billions we have given him.

Sic enim dilexit Deus mundum ut Filium suum unigenitum daret ut omnis qui credit in eum non pereat sed habeat vitam aeternam.

0 funny, 0 helpful.

oneforyourmillion says on Nov 5, 2009, 04:28:

I would like to know how the US benefits from having Colombia as a puppet? What does the US need Colombia for something? Arepas and chorizo shortage in the US? Colombia is a protectionist trade partner, partner??? Insert laugh here.

Why a puppet? What does the US have to gain?

0 funny, 0 helpful.

kingfish5515 says on Nov 5, 2009, 04:50:

Is Uribe a puppet for he usa?
answer==== no no absolutely not

Is the author of this biased article a puppet of Hugo and/or of communism/socialism??
answer==== yes yes absolutley yes

kingfish

0 funny, 1 helpful.

oneforyourmillion says on Nov 5, 2009, 04:55:

yep well now that is true? Why I asked the question but to expect a socialist to step up and explain their propoganda is the trick.

Typically the message needs to be delivered by a powerful and charismatic messenger or just one who speaks very elequent or perhaps has the ability to keep you focused on some other aspect of him or her so the message really does not get questioned. Anyway a colorful presentation is a bonus when your convincing people that your horse dung is actually food for plants.

0 funny, 0 helpful.

makopp5 (☼Travelguide writer) says on Nov 5, 2009, 05:55:

so lets see, where is the great economy from Chavez:
Oilfields, no investments, oil production is going back every year.
Infrastructure: water shortage, and electricity shortage
Investments negative, because nobody wants to invest, or lots of venezuelan companys are now investing in Colombia
Arms, spending billons in arms, without haveing a problem like colombia
Employment: unemployment rising
security: much more unsecure than Colombia withoiut having terrorists like Colombia
big part of the insecurity comes from government employees
the most corrupt government in L.A.
Liberty of speech? nearly do not exist.

WHERE ARE THE POSITVE POINTS FROM CHAVEZ?
only the poverty was going slightly back, but not much for this oilprices

Who of you guys want to live in Colombia or Venezuela? And why?

BK you want thios for Colombia?

0 funny, 1 helpful.

oneforyourmillion says on Nov 5, 2009, 06:33:

I just wish that oil would mvoe down to about $20 a barrel Chavez would implode..

But if you talk to some people from Venezula they swear that the US is afraid of Chavez cutting off the oil and all that nonsense. Oil is gobally traded and the gap would be filled in a para second. In fact I wish he would so that we could sieze his heavy crude refineries in the US and refine Colombian heavy crude or that which Saudi Arabia is setting on comming out their ears with no place to refine it.

If we don't buy it where does he sell it? Heavy crude refineries are not a dime a dozen in this world. Basically what I am saying is he is full of it and people just beleive it like it is from a burning bush.....

0 funny, 0 helpful.

greg says on Nov 5, 2009, 08:11:

El Expatriado says on Nov 5, 2009, 02:26 (today): flag

Escuse me, biut I find a lot of Latin Americans and other people with low self esteem in developing countries are really good at blaming all thier problems on someone else. The "Multi-national corporations" make a good, convenein, popular scapegoat.

People should start taking responsibility for their own situation, and make the best of what is available insted of blaming others on their short comings.

And when they do try to do something about it they end up dead. A good example is what Conagra has done in Brazil!

0 funny, 0 helpful.

makopp5 (☼Travelguide writer) says on Nov 5, 2009, 08:38:

bk
as I suspected the writer is a big fan from Marx and Farc, just google a little bit

0 funny, 1 helpful.

Mephisto410 says on Nov 5, 2009, 08:51:

wolfttz says on Nov 4, 2009, 17:29: flag
“Remember, when push comes to shove the USA still has the big bombs.”

So did the USSR, but that didn’t stop it from collapsing.

Juepaje im with you, I live in the US and would do what I have to to defend it, yet I disagree with what the corporations are doing. Along with john perkins book also read Open Veins of Latin America by Eduardo Galeano. Its not proganda its just the truth about what happens when there is a concentration of power and money, it just corrupts.

oneforyourmillion says on Nov 5, 2009, 04:28 (today): flag
I would like to know how the US benefits from having Colombia as a puppet? What does the US need Colombia for something? Arepas and chorizo shortage in the US? Colombia is a protectionist trade partner, partner??? Insert laugh here.

This shows a complete ignorance of economics, not that I am an economist myself but read the books mentioned above. Latin America is extremely wealthy with natural resources, all the silver mined from peru was more than 3 times the total that existed in Europe until that time, yet what did peru get for it, nothing but misery. The same happens with all resources there, they are taken away and all the profits go to foreign corporations. In the last 30 years the retail price of coffee (what I pay for it at the supermarket) for example has more than doubled (im being conservative I believe the actual number was quadrupled but I cant find the source now and I read it a while ago) when adjusted for inflation. Do you think the price that the laborers in the fields have gotten paid four times as much, or even the small farm owners have gotten much more when adjusted for inflation?? Of course not, the winners are the corporations and the speculators. The same for everything else from latin America, metals, agricultural products, everything. Some of the oligarch down there get their share to keep them happy and because they facilitate the plunder and pillage, but nothing compared to what the real winners are taking. The reason it happens is because the average American does not know that its going on. The oligarch here is just like anywhere else, power corrupts and that’s never going to change.

In my personal opinion, im no expert its just an opinion, the oligarch here is taking what it can now because they see that the US keeping the world at bay while they come in and rob them blind will not be easily sustained in the world of instant media. Youtube videos and instant access by the oppressed to the whole world audience is hard to control, unless they succeed in duming them down with sports, mtv, and everything else they can throw at them to keep them on the sofa.

Induite vos arma Dei ut possitis stare adversus insidias diaboli

1 funny, 1 helpful.

miamimike says on Nov 5, 2009, 10:46:

Uribe and Colombia will dance to the tune of the US music as long as they want Plan Colombia money. When the USA says Jump, all Uribe needs to ask is "How High". No doubt he will jump,,,Or NO future plan Colombia money. Look no farther than what happned to Tinhorn Daniel Ortega and Plan Nicaraugua money the past couple years when Ortega butted heads with Uncle Sam, acabo la plata. Same for Honduras . lol

An emphatic Yes to the OP's question.

No hay Peor Ciego que el que no quiere Ver o Sordo que el que no quiera Oir--Soy Yo, Sarah Palin, Wasilla Alaska.

1 funny, 0 helpful.

billyb says on Nov 5, 2009, 10:48:

"Look no farther than what happned to Ortiz and Plan Nicaraugua money the past couple years when Ortiz butted heads with Uncle Sam, acabo la plata. lol"

Mike, there's no Ortiz in power in Nicaragua, I am sure you mean Ortega? But you knew that already, didn't you :)

"All I want to know is where I'm going to die, so I never go there" Unkown (at least to me) wise man.

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miamimike says on Nov 5, 2009, 10:57:

Thanks Billy, corrected my Typo. I hope that passes muster with you. And glad you agree with the main gist of my post. So true!

No hay Peor Ciego que el que no quiere Ver o Sordo que el que no quiera Oir--Soy Yo, Sarah Palin, Wasilla Alaska.

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medefockinllin says on Nov 5, 2009, 11:17:

Uribe is a servant of the Santos family and by obligation is a puppet of Uncle Sam.

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billyb says on Nov 5, 2009, 11:32:

"Thanks Billy, corrected my Typo, I hope that passes muster with you"

I'm just happy I could help out.

"All I want to know is where I'm going to die, so I never go there" Unkown (at least to me) wise man.

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webmanco says on Nov 5, 2009, 12:31:

No hay extremo cierto o verdadero, porque los extremos opacan, enruedan, (lavan cerebros) verdades. Yotas

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oneforyourmillion says on Nov 5, 2009, 13:54:

This shows a complete ignorance of economics, not that I am an economist myself but read the books mentioned above. Latin America is extremely wealthy with natural resources, all the silver mined from peru was more than 3 times the total that existed in Europe until that time??"
Mephisto

Oh yes I am ignorant.... Guess who is the number one producer of gold in the world? USA. Don't tell me how ignorant I am and then talk about how rich Colombia is. South America is not even in the top 3. That is beyond ignorant but I know it helps to beleive that crapola about Colombia bing rich in mineral wealth. But I know beter than to debate the facts with people who invent them.

greg Well said.

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SiV says on Nov 5, 2009, 13:57:

Couldn't be arsed to read the opening post; but in answer to the question whether Uribe is a US puppet, well, yes obviously. Well, maybe not a puppet per se, but a definite yes-man.

Stultórum númere infinitum est.

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Mephisto410 says on Nov 5, 2009, 14:20:

Onefor, that was not a personal attack, but take it as you may. i was stating my opinion. as for what you are saying, i dont know where you got that from, in 2008 the USA was number 3 producer of gold in the world, first was China, second South Africa, so as to "I know beter than to debate the facts with people who invent them" i would think you are speaking to yourself?? Peru alone was number 5 in the world, combine all south american countries and it adds up to a large percentage of the worlds gold production. Also you are ignoring most of what i stated, only focusing on the fact that you thought it was a personal attack. you can check the link below for further breakdown of other countries.

http://news.goldseek.com/Dani/1242675860.php

Induite vos arma Dei ut possitis stare adversus insidias diaboli

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Mephisto410 says on Nov 5, 2009, 14:33:

i kept reading and the US is not the main producer but is the number one refiner which actually helps my argument. they take the raw gold ore from other places in the world and refine it, again the middle man taking most of the profit, and the local miners dying of lung disease and starvation.

Induite vos arma Dei ut possitis stare adversus insidias diaboli

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gatogris says on Nov 5, 2009, 14:34:

This post is a stale re-hash of many topics that have played out in a much more nuanced way on this site already.

The US is not interested in Empire (except for some of the more marginalized, fanatical neo-cons) because it is an out-moded idea.

The US, like China and Venezuela for that matter, is interested in comparative advantages.

Let me break it down for you, girlfriend - free-market capitalism and democratic socialism as global ideologies are both yesterday's news (fish wrapper!). The new governance buzzword now is Security - military, economic, and social. This is the prime-mover behind most Nation-state alliances.

Why does Colombia ally itself so closely with the US? Not just because of the cash, its because the US military is still the most competent at asymmetrical warfare out there, despite its struggles in Mid-East. Colombia needs that security, and more specifically, Uribe needs that specific area of expertise to consolidate his legacy as defeater of the FARC.

Why do Bolivia and Ecuador stand so closely in line with Venezuela? Because its financial help stabilizes the insecurity of those vulnerable regimes. Do you know how many Presidents have been forced from office without finishing their terms in those two countries over the last 25 years? Neither do I, although I know its a whole lot.

Why is Brazil ruled by an economic pragmatist who talks leftist ideology, hands out populist economic assistance programs, but makes his deals with the global transnationals? Because he can offer some economic security to both the poor (meager) and the better-off (fatter) this way, without having to toady to anyone.

Why does Venezuela attempt to create an anti-US coalition? Because it helps the electoral 'security' of its leader.

Stay secure, it's the name of the game.

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Byron_Kostner says on Nov 5, 2009, 14:36:

makopp, "BK you want this for Colombia?"

No, but that is besides the point. That does not change the fact that the US corporations have taken advantage of all the good people in Latin America, enslaved them if you will, all for "the good of US interests." It's all very complicated, but wish more people were aware of the many atrocities committed in Latin America by greedy scoundrels with no respect for human life.

Actions speak louder than words, but the self-righteous crusaders want to live by their own rules.

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makopp5 (☼Travelguide writer) says on Nov 5, 2009, 14:55:

BK
"Actions speak louder than words, "
so, who cares about the articule, it`s just talking without real solutions. That`s the problem with all the lefty`s they talk a lot but are not able to do anything real positive. Show me a country where the marxism or socialism or comunism realy works? Cuba, no, Nicaragua, no, Venezuela, no, Chile and Brasil are the best examples and Colombia is not fare behind, it needs time to make a better Colombia and we are on the right way. The Colombians see that like this too, for that reason Uribe is so popular, if you like it or not.

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turnmeon (☼Travelguide writer) says on Nov 5, 2009, 15:13:

it doesnt have anything to do with Colombia, shouldnt it be moved to off topic?

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medefockinllin says on Nov 5, 2009, 15:24:

makopp5 - your form of arguing is very unusual. If someone disagrees with you, you assume that they must have a view on the extreme of other side of the spectrum. If someone disagrees with neo-cons it does not mean that they are communists or socialists.....they just disagree and are not condoning views at the other extreme.

I have noticed this pattern in your responses to the views of others and frankly this form of argument doesn't cut it.

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makopp5 (☼Travelguide writer) says on Nov 5, 2009, 15:29:

mede
so show me how colombia should go a better way. What are you personally doing?

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medefockinllin says on Nov 5, 2009, 15:44:

There you go again.....

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oneforyourmillion says on Nov 5, 2009, 15:53:

Well depends on what it is you read. I have read US being number one, number two, number three just do a search and you will see it like that but I have never read any SA country being anything but down on the list. Australia, S. Africa and Russia at the top. China? I don't think so....

But here is what your missing. The US is helping because they do not want to see South America become a problem for them the way Africa is for Europe and your buddy Chavez is hell bent on turning SA into Africa, look at what has heppend to his country since he took over. Uribe is not as stupid and for that he is receiving help. I heard this same stupid argument about Iraq and that we were going to steal the oil from them? Well did we? No we did not. Who was and is getting that oil? Europe.

I saw a fly over today of some 16 US jets. I hope they flew the border so that big mouth Chavez and all his cheering fans can see what force looks like and know who and what it is he is threatening with his brovado and everyone over there can smell his bull. That will keep the peace as it has for thousands of years. the minute junior FARC hears and sees a F16 comming by at MACH 1 or so the recruitment days are over.

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makopp5 (☼Travelguide writer) says on Nov 5, 2009, 16:00:

mede
so, if you don`t like it put me on ignore.

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medefockinllin says on Nov 5, 2009, 16:21:

Why should I ignore you? Your opinions are entertaining.

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medefockinllin says on Nov 5, 2009, 16:23:

oneforyourmillionm - I think that your Iraq oil argument on Europe relates to buyers of oil. Who awarded the contracts to the companies that are making money out of it? Oh....and have you ever heard of Halliburton and Dick Cheney?

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oneforyourmillion says on Nov 5, 2009, 16:54:

Yes and the contracts are going ot Europe as well but that is not what your camp was saying. They were saying that the US ws going to steal their oil. If those US contractors benefit from US dollar being spent over there which is exactly what it is then wtf you talking about willis?

I get you Colombia is a super rich country and the US is commin to steal all the riches... Yea right mo fo and what are all the illegal Colombians doing that come across the border, work illegal and send the money back? You want to get to the real world here and now? That is BIG money Colombians are robbing from the US economy today and everyday. Not some futuristic fantasy bullshit possibility with no basis in history or reality.

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medefockinllin says on Nov 5, 2009, 17:05:

I am no in the anti-US camp....just the get-the-facts-straight camp.

Oil contracts incorporate a variety of functions, from setting up infrastructure to exploration, drilling and refinery.
Halliburton was the biggest beneficiary from infrastructure contracts and BP (UK) and Exxon (US) were the biggest beneficiaries in exploration, drilling and refinery. Which two countries were the two biggest protagonists of the illegal war on Iraq?

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webmanco says on Nov 5, 2009, 17:14:

War and drugs are big business, where USA wants and is getting a piece of action.

.............
cheering fans can see what force looks like
...................

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/27/world/asia/27afghan.html

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/01/us/01crash.html?_r=1

http://www.eltiempo.com/mundo/euycanada/autor-de-masacre-en-base-de-eu...

Armaments do backfires more than often.

Anyone believing the USA is getting its servicemen killed abroad, out charity, need to smell the coffe or stop sniffing...............

They do it for profit.

No hay extremo cierto o verdadero, porque los extremos opacan, enruedan, (lavan cerebros) verdades. Yotas

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medefockinllin says on Nov 5, 2009, 18:25:

Webmanco speaks the whole truth and nothing but the truth.

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miamimike says on Nov 5, 2009, 18:55:

Who awarded the contracts to the companies that are making money out of it? Oh....and have you ever heard of Halliburton and Dick Cheney?
--------------------------------------------------------------------

Bingo! Dick "Many Military Deferments" Cheney,,,Cheney told Uribe to jump, Uribe says how high Dick,,,

No hay Peor Ciego que el que no quiere Ver o Sordo que el que no quiera Oir--Soy Yo, Sarah Palin, Wasilla Alaska.

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medefockinllin says on Nov 5, 2009, 20:18:

Why TF have US military personnel been granted diplomatic immunity? What is the rationale behind this? This is seriously f ed up.

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El Expatriado says on Nov 6, 2009, 03:18:

Brian, your the only one that has concluded he is a puppet, by your own definition.

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El Expatriado says on Nov 6, 2009, 03:24:

When it comes to political discussions I know Notink.. notink... (for now anyway, ). I'd rather talk about hot Colombian babes or hockey.

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oneforyourmillion says on Nov 6, 2009, 04:57:

The point was the US did not rob the oil from Iraq. We lost trillions of dollas and billions of US dollars paid to Haliburton and whatever contractor you want to name. The US government, US tax payer paid that bill not the Iraqi people. Get your facts straight.

They could have paid Halliburton to raise buffalo in Kansas and it would have been the same thing only they would not have gotten away with it.

THE POINT IS FOR YOU LEARNING IMPAIRED IS THE MONEY SPENT ON HALIBURTON WAS US TAXPAYER MONEY NOT IRAQI MONEY. So who was robbing who? Who got robbed? The US working man that is who so shut up and set down.

Get your facts straight.

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medefockinllin says on Nov 6, 2009, 08:55:

OFYM - you are right, the US taxpayer has been robbed more than Iraq and the next XXX generations will still be paying off this debt.

The biggest winners are the arms manufacturers, oil companies, and Israel.......and you the US taxpayer are to thank.

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El Expatriado says on Nov 8, 2009, 02:28:

I think the biggest winners are the granola companies from all the granola gruncher types who have invaded this site.

By the way, Halliburton isn't an oil Company, it's an oil service company.

But then, I know notinkk..

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El Expatriado says on Nov 8, 2009, 02:35:

By the way, all of you who hate the oil companies and oil industry should maybe walko your next vacation, or maybe just stay home.

Or invent some other form of energy and quit making up stories tha it's already been done and the oil companies paid off or killed the inventor.

I your not part of the soloution, your part of the problem. Just like the coke head who continues to use the stuff and keeps blaming the dealers for all his problems.

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MitchAlvarez says on Nov 10, 2009, 01:10:

same crap is still going on in here...........

Uribe is the best president colombia has EVER had.

dejen la maricada pues!

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Lisa Zee says on Nov 10, 2009, 09:35:

Yeah Mich, I agree with you. ( estabas muy perdido!) welcome back.

Vive la vida y deja vivir!.

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Costeña says on Nov 10, 2009, 09:50:

Uribe was Bush´s whippng boy.......Uribe is Colombias worst Para and history will reflect this.........

Why did you come to Colombia ?????

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makopp5 (☼Travelguide writer) says on Nov 10, 2009, 09:52:

Costeña
sorry, but the mayority aproves the work of Uribe by 63%, if you like it or not.

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Costeña says on Nov 10, 2009, 09:59:

The % who aprove are in the big 4 safer cities... In the smaller towns he used Para Military threats at the polls last election.
To each his own opnion, but he is always surrounded by Para types his staff and friends have been shown to be Paras...
Take a trip to Choco and ask about Uribe, ask the local indios in the Sierra Nevadas about Uribe AUC Velez...............................................................
The Fool in Venezuela Chavez has a high % of support, does that make him not a puppet of Castro.......................................................................................

Why did you come to Colombia ?????

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makopp5 (☼Travelguide writer) says on Nov 10, 2009, 10:37:

costeña
colombia has 44 millon.

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MitchAlvarez says on Nov 10, 2009, 11:19:

blah blah blah.... anyways.......... costena move to a big city then jajaj

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Costeña says on Nov 10, 2009, 15:07:

Its cool ,you like Uribe, I hate Uribe ...... The world would be boring if we were all the same...

Why did you come to Colombia ?????

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MitchAlvarez says on Nov 10, 2009, 15:43:

agreed

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MitchAlvarez says on Nov 10, 2009, 15:44:

but just to point out.... i like uribe because i love colombia.

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Costeña says on Nov 10, 2009, 19:32:

I love Colombia my kds are all Colombians , I pray my kids are wise enough not be fooled by Uribe´s....
Like Bush and his hype about keeping the US safe got GWB supporters, Uribe got his supporters with F.A.R.C. hype ........
Indios, Afro Colombanos,displaced and many others have yet to reap Uribe rewards...........................

Why did you come to Colombia ?????

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makopp5 (☼Travelguide writer) says on Nov 10, 2009, 19:53:

Just ask the people, if they want go back to 2002, without Uribe.

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Costeña says on Nov 10, 2009, 20:58:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,191991,00.html
http://www.eltiempo.com/archivo/documento/CMS-3455840
http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5gBZjOvIOi6hYtaE3zHlhgwMMr_oQ
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/04/22/AR2008...

Where there is smoke there is usally fire.
If it walks like a duck quacks like duck = Duck
If its A.U.C. connected and para political = Alvaro Urbe

Why did you come to Colombia ?????

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MitchAlvarez says on Nov 11, 2009, 00:54:

bullshit propaganda..... costena how long have u lived in colombia? what region? any encounters with narcos, organized crime or guerilla?

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oneforyourmillion says on Nov 11, 2009, 04:37:

You know Uribe is not perfect but this is Colombia and in Colombia they have more than proven the soft touch, the ability to elect the feel good guy. They have PAID A HUGE price some of them for that way of thinking in Colombia. Those days are done until of course the opinion of the bleeding heart becomes in style again and then Colombia will go back to the days of kidnappings, bombs and extortion. People have such short memories and they are ungreatful for the sacrifices of others and well that includes Uribe.

Want to see it today take a look at this liberal mess that is in Bogota. This place is going to shit under this mayor.

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